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CSU/USU suing MW over exit fees

PACs idea of poaching the best MWC teams was the right approach (create the strongest G5 possible) but the execution was piss poor, allowing ego to dictate decisions. They should have made a sweetheart deal for UNLV and SJSU as well, and also allow for free or low-cost exit fees if invited to a P4. Every G5 school goal is to get a P4 invite and making it easy to make the leap only incentivizes the schools to invest more in their programs. Then as you said also go after the top AAC schools and any potential additions from an ACC breakup. You’d then have a very competitive conference potentially challenging B12 status. Instead their egos ruled the day and now they’re chasing small market teams that will only dilute their status. MWC is in that same boat but the difference is the PAC put themselves in that situation. Idiots.
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CSU/USU suing MW over exit fees

The argument you will hear is they took the best teams and therfore weakened your brand, which arguably they did. But that logic doesn't account for what you just spelled out and the fact that you're banking on the bottom half- CSU, OSU, USU, SDSU and possibly Fresno improve beyond mediocre to the point that they're able to challenge Boise. WSU just entered a death spiral that'll likely lead to mediocrity over challenging Boise. That's the perception you're fighting, especially if you enter into the new conference (2026 season) and 4 of the teams you're taking all finish sub .500 again next year, along with WSU taking a nose dive...

This is true, but now apply it to the MWC.

The teams they took have won every conference title since 2016 except the Covid year of 2020. (SJSU). Boise, Fresno, USU and SDSU.
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CSU/USU suing MW over exit fees

You lost me after the bolded part. So we should have ended up with the PacMtn 24? Best go see if there is any spiked eggnog left in the bowl, and drink up.
Would you not gave pursued Tulane, UTSA, USF, and Memphis, to undercut the AAC and maximize the chance of the MWC winner getting the autobid each year? Would you not have pursued Gonzaga and St Marys to undercut the WCC in basketball, if they were available at reasonable percentages, not the condition the pac gave them? Maybe, UC Davis and GCU would be a stretch.

CSU/USU suing MW over exit fees

WSU is already in a world of chaos. Possible money issues to cap it off. Norvell may already be making the top end of what they may be willing to pay.

For sure.

I just want to see it for my own gratification.

WSU has some serious debt. Serious money issues. Part of the reason Dickert left. They just slashed millions from athletic budget.

68th

It's not really a new system though. The spread offense Dan runs is very common in today's game. In fact it's probably easier to learn than the Go-Go in terms of formations. Defensive maybe, but defense is pretty reactive and instinctive from base formation
To your point almost every person on the team at some point of their life has been part of a spread offense, or has defended against the spread.

CSU/USU suing MW over exit fees

I agree. They should have done the reverse merger with conditions that pay certain schools less, then took the available funds to pursue Gonzaga, UC Davis, GCU, St. Marys, Tulane, Memphis, UTSA, USF and possibly Wichita State, UConn (with basketball) or Liberty. Instead they are in litigation while the MWC locked down UNLV, Air Force, GCU, UC Davis, etc. and the AAC schools rejected them. At this point, why would a nonPac whatever school trust the current Pac leadership.
You lost me after the bolded part. So we should have ended up with the PacMtn 24? Best go see if there is any spiked eggnog left in the bowl, and drink up.

CSU/USU suing MW over exit fees

The argument you will hear is they took the best teams and therfore weakened your brand, which arguably they did. But that logic doesn't account for what you just spelled out and the fact that you're banking on the bottom half- CSU, OSU, USU, SDSU and possibly Fresno improve beyond mediocre to the point that they're able to challenge Boise. WSU just entered a death spiral that'll likely lead to mediocrity over challenging Boise. That's the perception you're fighting, especially if you enter into the new conference (2026 season) and 4 of the teams you're taking all finish sub .500 again next year, along with WSU taking a nose dive...

CSU/USU suing MW over exit fees

IMO other than the money we will HOPEFULLY get there is nothing positive about being in the even crapier MWC. It will be used against us in recruiting. Viewership will go down. TV revenue will go down and that sucks even more because u can use that to pay the players. Not one positive long term will come out of this. Does not look good dominating a crappy conference.

CSU/USU suing MW over exit fees

You’re right… a lot to be settled. I’m sure the “PAC” fans are happy… they feel like they’re somehow in the “cool kids” club, which just isn’t the case. They finally got invited to the party, paid the cover charge, and found out that there’s no chics there, and now their rationalizing.

As far as cutting out fat goes… they started out a solid 6 teams with good markets (compared to the MW)… then they added Utah State (who doesn’t move the needle media market wise) and have to add another still to even be a conference. Then they give Gonzaga a full share and I think I read something where teams get to keep their NCAA tourney credits as well.

So from a standpoint of cutting fat, I’m not so sure they have.

You had your original 6 and let’s just say they were all going to be pulling relatively equal weight… obviously you have Boise at the top and CSU at the bottom, but on balance you feel that everyone is equal.

Then you add Utah State… are they really more of a draw than Wyoming, UNM, or UNR? I’d say not by any measurable amount during any five year stretch. So I’d say you just diluted your conference by about 15%.

Then you add Gonzaga… good move, but at what price? When football accounts for 80% of media valuation, does Gonzaga’s value in basketball make up for not playing football? And if it is true that they’d get to keep their NCAA credits or at least the lion share, then hasn’t that diluted your per team distributions even more? It’s kind of a wild card but I’d suspect it ends up costing them all on a per team distribution level.

Now add your 8th team… there’s nobody left and whoever it is will be a much larger drag than any lower tier MW team has been.

So now 25% of your teams in football
I agree. They should have done the reverse merger with conditions that pay certain schools less, then took the available funds to pursue Gonzaga, UC Davis, GCU, St. Marys, Tulane, Memphis, UTSA, USF and possibly Wichita State, UConn (with basketball) or Liberty. Instead they are in litigation while the MWC locked down UNLV, Air Force, GCU, UC Davis, etc. and the AAC schools rejected them. At this point, why would a nonPac whatever school trust the current Pac leadership.

CSU/USU suing MW over exit fees

We will know once everything settles in. Most PAC fans are super happy with the move so far. Actually a lot of people thought it was a good move.
It will be a better deal for them financially. They will cut out a lot of fat financially and with competition.
Will it be marginal? Maybe. But it will be a better league.
You’re right… a lot to be settled. I’m sure the “PAC” fans are happy… they feel like they’re somehow in the “cool kids” club, which just isn’t the case. They finally got invited to the party, paid the cover charge, and found out that there’s no chics there, and now their rationalizing.

As far as cutting out fat goes… they started out a solid 6 teams with good markets (compared to the MW)… then they added Utah State (who doesn’t move the needle media market wise) and have to add another still to even be a conference. Then they give Gonzaga a full share and I think I read something where teams get to keep their NCAA tourney credits as well.

So from a standpoint of cutting fat, I’m not so sure they have.

You had your original 6 and let’s just say they were all going to be pulling relatively equal weight… obviously you have Boise at the top and CSU at the bottom, but on balance you feel that everyone is equal.

Then you add Utah State… are they really more of a draw than Wyoming, UNM, or UNR? I’d say not by any measurable amount during any five year stretch. So I’d say you just diluted your conference by about 15%.

Then you add Gonzaga… good move, but at what price? When football accounts for 80% of media valuation, does Gonzaga’s value in basketball make up for not playing football? And if it is true that they’d get to keep their NCAA credits or at least the lion share, then hasn’t that diluted your per team distributions even more? It’s kind of a wild card but I’d suspect it ends up costing them all on a per team distribution level.

Now add your 8th team… there’s nobody left and whoever it is will be a much larger drag than any lower tier MW team has been.

So now 25% of your teams in football

Is one of y'all pretending to be a South Carolina fan?

Yeah was surprised he didn't play more. Maybe Camac's play negated the need to do that?

Still a guy I'd really like to see them get back. I think in Arnett's defense that guy would be a menace. Might be first guy for UNLV to reach double digit sacks in forever.
Just pay the man.

Is one of y'all pretending to be a South Carolina fan?

The plan was to use him as LB that lined up on edge sporadically. Pop back and forth depending on the play call. Don’t know the reason why it didn’t happen.

Yeah was surprised he didn't play more. Maybe Camac's play negated the need to do that?

Still a guy I'd really like to see them get back. I think in Arnett's defense that guy would be a menace. Might be first guy for UNLV to reach double digit sacks in forever.

Is one of y'all pretending to be a South Carolina fan?

F8ck, I hope this kid isn't another Brennon Scott. Same built, same dominance in HS. Just disappeared.

Scott got bit by injuries.

Laster was a true freshman. He got massive after getting on campus. Heard he's up from 220 to 250 ish (not out of shape actual good weight) Odom mentioned him moving from LB to defensive end because of it.

I think he didn't see the field much this year because he was learning a new position and there were more experienced guys ahead of him. There was no reason to play him that much and burn his red shirt. He only appeared in one game.

CSU/USU suing MW over exit fees

Actually they turned down a 30 mil deal from ESPN after the LA schools left.

So how low were OSU and WAZZU's value to drop the overall value of that deal.

Well the big 10 and big 12 thought those schools were worth about 30 mil a piece. Neither conference thought that the remaining 2 schools were but there is no way they are worth less than 10 each on average. The math doesn't make sense if they were.

Now those schools are obviously worth less now tham with the others but I think many are really undervaluing their media worth.

Follow the money. The Pac 2 said no to merger for a reason and it wasn't just pride. They broke off because they knew they would make more even with potentially high up front costs.

Obviously things did not go as planned, but there is no way they are worth anything near what the new MW will be. We have some really poor markets and I think that will hurt us down the road.

PAC deal will be better than MWC deal. There's no doubt there. The pertinent questions in my mind are:

First being, how much better?

Second being, at what number would it make sense for UNLV to ditch the MWC (assuming there's still an invite to be had) ? I have to imagine nything North of 10 million per year would be pretty damn enticing.

Third being if the PAC number comes in at 10 mil or more and UNLV again turns it down what would we make of that?

The Big12 is really in play and UNLV wants it's free pass from MWC?

Because I can't see any reason to stay in the MWC if an opportunity to double your media revenue is on the table.
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