Back in April I mentioned to all of you that this could become reality. I would recommend approaching this article with an open mind because the Concept may be Foreign (Similar to Premier league soccer). This is only works for Football. They're looking at ways to generate TV revenue for small market teams. If you play wining Football you get to stay in the Pac 12. If your team is not good enough and you finish at the bottom of the conference you are "Relegated" to the MWC.
Pac-12 & MWC in serious talks about "Relegation"
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Just seems like a scheme devised by the PAC 2 to make sure they get the maximum amount of $$. They feel they will be in the "promoted" division no matter what and will annually get the lions share of the revenue. The "relegated" folks (us) will get the leftovers. If I was UNLV I'd take a hard pass.
Wife - I’m going to do other dudes, ok? Don’t worry, you’ll still get some too, once a month.
Only a fool is ok with that.
I'm expecting us to be promoted to the Pac 12 every year. We have one of the highest paid coaches in the league and #1 Ranked recruiting class for 24. I have a feeling the cut off would be 7 wins. I also believe that we will be adding more schools. A 24 team league to start out sounds about right.
The problem with this, especially with different money tiers is that wins don't always equal TV eyeballs.
Case in point SJSU won the MW, but I doubt many people cared in the bay area when that happened.
The counter my own point, if we have the same TV partners then they will still capture the better markets in the lower league. But, it is pretty safe to say that if the better markets are in the better league, there will probably be more interest and more revenue potential.
I don't like adding small markets like the article suggests. I think they need to go after UTSA, maybe UTEP. Get into Texas, we already have Wyoming and Boise, we don't need North and South Daktoa.
But the better markets should be in the PAC to maximize revenue for everyone.
Case in point SJSU won the MW, but I doubt many people cared in the bay area when that happened.
The counter my own point, if we have the same TV partners then they will still capture the better markets in the lower league. But, it is pretty safe to say that if the better markets are in the better league, there will probably be more interest and more revenue potential.
I don't like adding small markets like the article suggests. I think they need to go after UTSA, maybe UTEP. Get into Texas, we already have Wyoming and Boise, we don't need North and South Daktoa.
But the better markets should be in the PAC to maximize revenue for everyone.
In a true relegation league though, it wouldn't matter how many games you win. It's about where you finish in the group.
Currently, the MWC has 12 teams for football. The PAC only has 2 remaining, so that would put it at 14 teams. Seems too small to have 2 separate groups at that point, but lets assume that they get it to be 16 teams, with two groups of 8 to form each tier.
Top tier (year 1 guess)
1. Oregon State
2. Washington State
3. Air Force
4. Fresno State
5. Wyoming
6. San Diego State
7. Boise State
8. UNLV (or San Jose State, or CSU)
That's a really solid top 8 teams for football. We'll say that UNLV is in it initially, just for fun, even though there's a real chance that SJSU and/or CSU would be above us.
The season would play out, and at the end of the year, my guess is that either the last place team or the 2 bottom teams from this tier would then be relegated down to the lower division. At the same time, the top 1 or 2 teams from the lower division would then be bumped back up into the top division.
In order for something like this to make sense, the media deal would probably have to be for the conference as a whole, but then the dollar distribution would vary based on which tier you're in. They'd need to make it so that the bottom tier teams are still making a good chunk of money (as much or more as they'd make in the MWC alone), or there would be no reason for them to agree with this structure.
I think this is a horrible idea. With how UNLV has been we would constantly be in the relegated league. No thanks, hard pass!
They are Banking on story lines. Something to start a conversation with Amazon or Apple. They would follow multiple teams trying to "Avoid Relegation" or trying to be "promoted". Unfortunately coaches probably won't have to much say in how this goes down. Amazon Prime has several shows on Relegation and usually that coach would lose their jobs If their team is demoted. It's never been done with American Football and the new Pac-12 is desperate for a new TV contract and exposure. They are trying to be creative and think of something outside the box. They are very concerned about keeping their spot in the 12 team playoffs.
You may not have a choice. Sometimes you have to take what you can get. MWC has no leverage and will go a long with Oregon State and Wazzo. Remember this could only last a few years as the TV contract is up in 2026.
The article mentioned adding teams to get to 16 total teams 8/8. That way each league can still qualify as a full independent league.
It also mentioned that this idea is not new for college football. Apparently there are several schools in power leagues that want this to be a thing.
I think we could be a top 6 mountain west team. ( We're #4 right now! lol) I think though we would be on the hot seat for relegation every year too. Though hopefully Odom turns it around creates a winning culture and success can be maintained if he were to move on.
I believe we will backfill the MWC with new teams (Tulane,Rice,NMSU,UTSA). Look for streaming to become very important part of the next TV deal.
Yeah, right now, we'd be a top 6 team, but there's a lot of year to play out still. I think the critical things with regards to relegation are:
1. How the finances are handled (if you get more for being in the top tier)
2. Scheduling. In order for this to work, you need to have similar schedules for all of the teams. For example, if you end up one season not playing Hawaii, UNM, or UNR, but then another team ends up having games against all 3 of those teams, but not Air Force, Fresno or BSU, it's really not equivalent. Ideally, you'd play each team twice, once home and once away, but that would be too many games. I'm not sure how you could balance it to make it fair for everyone in that regard
The scheduling
The goal here is to create interesting, high-stakes matchups for fan experience and television purposes, relying on the previous season’s standings and the current season’s standings to orchestrate pairings.A team’s schedule would include two non-conference opponents, seven intra-conference games and three crossover games. For instance, in Year 1, Oregon State plays two non-conference games that they schedule, seven games against all the other Pac-12 teams and three games against those from the Mountain West.
Previous season results determine a pecking order to arrange matchups, such as:
- a Week 1 rematch of the previous year’s Pac-12 championship game.
- a Week 1 game between the two teams promoted from the Mountain West to the Pac-12 and two teams relegated from the Pac-12 to the Mountain West.
- a Bracket Buster Weekend in early to mid-November, where pairings are determined two weeks prior and are based off of current standings with the intent on arranging compelling, crossover matchups.
From the article:
The entire season builds up to a crescendo of a final week that features three games:
- A Relegation Game between the sixth- and seventh-placed teams in the Pac-12. The loser is relegated to the Mountain West. The eighth-place finisher in the regular season is automatically relegated.
- A Promotion Game between the second- and third-placed teams in the Mountain West. The winner is promoted to the Pac-12. The regular-season champion of the Mountain West is automatically promoted to the Pac-12.
- The Pac-12 championship game, where the winner has a significant chance to advance to the newly expanded College Football Playoff.
Promotion/relegation in college football? Game-changing idea could help save Pac-12
What if the Pac-12 and Mountain West changed the way college conferences operate by borrowing an idea from European soccer leagues?
The one issue is that it seems like some college teams have more volatility from season to season than professional teams do.
Example, team is in the lower league but have a season where they have a ton of experience coming back. They kill it in the lower league, and get promoted to the higher league for the next season. However, next season, that team loses everybody and has a down year. They then get moved back down.
I could see a scenario where the best 8 teams aren't necessarily in the top league for the given year. I guess the movement up and down is what relegation is all about. In that case, teams are rewarded monetarily for previous season's results.
Example, team is in the lower league but have a season where they have a ton of experience coming back. They kill it in the lower league, and get promoted to the higher league for the next season. However, next season, that team loses everybody and has a down year. They then get moved back down.
I could see a scenario where the best 8 teams aren't necessarily in the top league for the given year. I guess the movement up and down is what relegation is all about. In that case, teams are rewarded monetarily for previous season's results.
Football tends to be a little more steady then say basketball. But you do have a point. Professional leagues definitely have more consistency.
As somebody who loves the Prem's structure and Liverpool above and beyond any other sports team or league, I don't believe a promotion/relegation system would provide any competitive advantages on the macro level based on the MWC's scale compared to the P5. On a national level, not many care who the MWC champion is. Most probably couldn't tell you who won it last year. That won't change. In the end, it will simply be a way for the more successful programs to grab more of the revenue share. Outside of the MWC fanbase already in place, nobody will be tuning in later in the season to watch Nevada/New Mexico or Hawaii/Wyo or UNLV/??? duke it out to not get relegated or get promoted. I don't see this as generating more outside revenue or interest so what would the benefit be? One possible benefit is our program has inherent advantages now to be successful over most in the conference. It would be the final call for those in charge to step up to the plate. As someone not afraid to take risk, I like it for my school. I actually like Harp and Odom more than the bodies we've had in those positions in recent times. I know we are all jaded by the last 40 years (lol) but it's time to go for it and stop wallowing in the past if the opportunity is there to grab larger revenue share.
Additionally, unlike pro sports (English Premier League) where a team is not necessarily burdened by its previous record from making significant improvements, college recruiting will suffer significantly from a poor season and relegation as will its NIL budget making it VERY difficult to pull yourself out from relegation. The strong get stronger and the weak get weaker. I have serious doubt a relegation system can work in the college environment.
Big 12 and Big 10 have both talked about it...
Side note: I dont think were long for whatever this new alignment becomes. in the next 5 years, we wont be in this conference.. There's too much invested in facilities and $$ to stay in some mid-tiered wanna be P5. Alot of ifs in there, but Las Vegas is like the hottest thing in the sports world and if these P5s start moving championships here, theyll notice the $$$ and market potential
Side note: I dont think were long for whatever this new alignment becomes. in the next 5 years, we wont be in this conference.. There's too much invested in facilities and $$ to stay in some mid-tiered wanna be P5. Alot of ifs in there, but Las Vegas is like the hottest thing in the sports world and if these P5s start moving championships here, theyll notice the $$$ and market potential
All of this is covered in the article by Ross Dellenger. Pac 12 teams get more money. Also there would 3 crossover games for rivalries.
B1G is doing it They're looking at Vegas and Indianapolis rotation.
Remember they don't need UNLV to get Vegas.
In order for UNLV to be worth it, we need to capture more of that market. More people watching on TV and more people at the games.
PAC is more desperate than the Big 12, that is for sure.
In order for UNLV to be worth it, we need to capture more of that market. More people watching on TV and more people at the games.
PAC is more desperate than the Big 12, that is for sure.
I like it, but I hate it. It would definitely add some excitement and added motivation for each team. Making every conference game that much more important and enjoyable.
What I hate about this is the PAC2 are probably pushing this to keep that PAC money to themselves. If we help save the PAC, that money should be divided and definitely come into play in the negotiations.
What I hate about this is the PAC2 are probably pushing this to keep that PAC money to themselves. If we help save the PAC, that money should be divided and definitely come into play in the negotiations.
I know right now we are top 4-6 in the MWC but we also haven't played anybody in the MWC yet. Let's see were we are at in 5-6 weeks. Hopefully we are in that position but based off past we will be bottom 2-3 and always in the regulation league
"MWC has no leverage and will go a long with Oregon State and Wazzo."
I don't understand why we have no leverage. They can't have a two team conference. Our teams are locked in unless 9 vote to leave and that isn't happening. It looks like we have the leverage.
Agreed. I think the MWC has most of the leverage right now. With the buyout clause that it's in the MW deal, it makes it hard for anyone to jump ship without having guaranteed money on the other end.
It is true we are the more stable league right now, the thing is that pretty much every team in our league would rather be in the Pac.
I can see a relegation league work if and only if the new MW does not have to reduce their current TV payout. If they can make that work and have the PAC still get more money. it could happen.
For that to happen, they would have to bring in bigger markets to even have an outside shot. Even so that seems extremely unlikely.
The reason we don't have any leverage?
Because the Pac 12 has the name recognition!! And if we want to be a part of their league, we have to play by their rules. That doesn't sound like leverage to me. Wazzo and Oregon state are in charge And we will agree to what ever deal they want. The stability that you are talking about ends When our TV deal expires in 2 years. We really need a way to keep those 2 schools tied to the Pac 12 for long term. Then we have to hope that the other power 5 leagues accept this New Pac-12.
Because the Pac 12 has the name recognition!! And if we want to be a part of their league, we have to play by their rules. That doesn't sound like leverage to me. Wazzo and Oregon state are in charge And we will agree to what ever deal they want. The stability that you are talking about ends When our TV deal expires in 2 years. We really need a way to keep those 2 schools tied to the Pac 12 for long term. Then we have to hope that the other power 5 leagues accept this New Pac-12.
This is a terrible idea IMO. I would be shocked to see 9 votes in the MWC to dissolve and follow this format.
This idea undoubtedly was devised by OSU and WSU to fck us. It's more like a pyramid scheme. lol
Also, college football is very fluid and I could see unanticipated consequences down the road. For example a young rebuilding team could come in 3rd place in the bottem tier one year and not move up. Then the next year with the returning roster they could run the table in the bottom tier and it could be argued that they are the best team in the conference. Does this mean that that would be ineligible to play for the conference championship because they are in the tier 2 grouping despite going undefeated in conference? This is crazy.
I just heard on the radio that this idea came from Boise St. of all people!
I am not surprised at all! Also, they are on the down hill slide right now as a program. Odom will catch them over the next couple of years.
This is not a secret and has been mentioned in other power 5 conference meetings. There is no other option if we want to be in the league. This will pass by unanimous vote.
This is a terrible idea...
But if somehow that brings this entire cluster up to the same P5 level from a $$$ perspective and potential, then do whatever it takes...
But if somehow that brings this entire cluster up to the same P5 level from a $$$ perspective and potential, then do whatever it takes...
