That's probably the best option no doubt.
With how fluid things are, nothing would shock me though.
WSU Coug checking in
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That's probably the best option no doubt.
With how fluid things are, nothing would shock me though.
In the morning I would go with Bailey's (or a cheaper version) and coffee. Maybe with a sniff of Canadian whiskey if you need a bit of a jolt.
The MW is not very profitable with each school getting only a 4 mil a year with the TV contract. Many schools have athletic programs in the red, UNLV has been one of them until recently.
The likelihood that a G5 team actually wins the playoffs is very low, but the money for a seat at the table is substantial, and that is shared with the conference.
I agree that the big 2 conferences especially do not need the money, but they want to win championships.
For schools like us, we need the money. Also the idea of trying to make a miracle Cinderella run adds extra to it.
The next TV contract will be better for the MW, but exponentially lower than the power conferences, and what the PAC 2 are used to. I don't think that WAZZU or OSU are willing to lose 10's of millions per year ( compared to what they are used to) with a straight up merger.
That's why it makes sense to have a smaller conference cutting out the dead weight of the MW to maximize TV payouts. The PAC 2 are going to lose a lot of money regardless, but they can at least do some damage control by doing this proposed Bicostal conference.
Also the Conference championship game would make so much more money, due to intrigue and the involvement of east coast teams.
A straight up merger makes regional sense and would be so much easier. Because of that it could happen, arguably likely happen.
But to me, all of this realignment has been about the dollar above everything else. So I am hesitant to say a traditional merger will happen because of this. It will cost the PAC 2 a lot of potential money to do so.
The more I think about this east/west coast concept, the more it makes sense. We’d essentially be forming the strongest PAC2/MWC by including only the strongest, most profitable programs, but adding a few extra OOC games against the east coast conf and having a championship game at end of season. The championship game could draw a lot of intrigue as it would provide a “national” championship game juxtaposed against the two big conferences and it would make the east/west champion a logical inclusion in the 12-team playoff. Best of both worlds.
But is it though?
When it comes to the B1G and the SEC, very much in "want" the money territory.
For the G5 and below, "need" is closer. The costs of running a program are getting greater. Sure, the schools aren't paying the NILs (yet), but boosters are. Boosters also typically pay a big portion of coaches' salaries. Most schools do not have boosters with infinite money. Schools are going to need more to pay coaches' salaries, build facilities, etc.
On Profitability, you statement is not accurate, at least not last year (link below). Funny things, those facts.
Regarding the Pac-2, we have no other viable options. We got left out in the cold, and I see nothing in the tea leaves that says this will change. I don't buy the Bicoastal thing. At all. If the MW is so desirable to the ACC leftovers, then why is it so undesirable to the Pac-2? (granted including a couple of bottom feeders)
2022-23 Mountain West Revenue & Expenses
Air Force's revenue ranked 57th nationally, and all but one MWC school turned a fiscal profit.
superwestsports.com
Your Pac 2 are trying to be relevant, let them try. Simple fact is that they have failed and now they try to looks like some genius shits? The MWC dont need you and so you can go and sucks a dick and f*ck off.On Profitability, you statement is not accurate, at least not last year (link below). Funny things, those facts.
Regarding the Pac-2, we have no other viable options. We got left out in the cold, and I see nothing in the tea leaves that says this will change. I don't buy the Bicoastal thing. At all. If the MW is so desirable to the ACC leftovers, then why is it so undesirable to the Pac-2? (granted including a couple of bottom feeders)
2022-23 Mountain West Revenue & Expenses
Air Force's revenue ranked 57th nationally, and all but one MWC school turned a fiscal profit.
Wow. Where is that coming from? Merging with the Pac-2 is a good thing for the MW. Merging with the MW is a landing place for OSU and WSU, and we have been nothing but respectful and grateful for the lifeline.
So what's up your ass?
I have never said UNLV or the MW needed the Pac-2. The Pac-2 is paying handsomely for the "scheduling agreement". Didn't hear any bitching about that. The Pac-2 will/would raise the profile of the MW. So no, the MW does not need us. But I think that most of you all would want us.
Regardless, I don't think that "you can go and sucks a dick and f*ck off" is really a comment that needs to or deserves to be made. And it is grammatically incorrect.
Trip relax...
Good lord. Dude came on here being very complementary of UNLV and potential new conference.
You're treating him like @wolfgang jayn who absolutely deserves all the venom.
Forgive us for Trip..
He means well. (I think)
He just goes off the rails sometimes...(Quite a bit actually)..
But we love him..(Well like that brother that annoys you but he's your brother so...)
Actually Trip, you're right, we don't need them but we're better with them than without.
Thanks buddy.
We have a few on my site, and I've been one of them a time or two. But in general we have reformed. Or maybe have been humbled.
Peace.
Thanks buddy.
We have a few on my site, and I've been one of them a time or two. But in general we have reformed. Or maybe have been humbled.
Peace.
Back to main topic.
If you were commissioner of the new merged conference are you just combining PAC-2 with existing MWC in its entirety? trimming some fat? looking to expand?
Well let's see, and I am not that familliar with the conference overall. Also, despite the fact that my Cougs (and the Beavers) have risen up from time to time over the decades in various sports, we have been sort of red-headed stepchildren in the PAC and historical iterations. So I have an affinity for the little guys.
Geographically, the existing layout is desirable, especially when you lay WSU and OSU in there. I know UNLV doesn't like UNR, and I believe that New Mexico is deemed undesirable. Throw in one sport Hawaii, and is that the group that the rest of the MW would like to jettison? SJSU is just too close to the Bay Area to be tossed IMHO.
So I dunno. I think 12 is a minimum, so pick the 2 you want to throw out. Or keep 'em all and stay at 14. If I was to pick any to toss it would be one sport Hawaii. Much as I like them as a destination. Maybe they would just go independent and play most all the conference anyway. So then maybe add NM State to keep the number even?
As said by me and others, you guys are hanging in there just fine. But reconstituting as the Pac-14 with Gloria at the helm is good for all of us. I know I'm a broken record, but stay out West where we all belong.
Hawaii would likely one to go in my opinion if it stayed 12.
SJSU I see arguments both ways. I hate to lose a California school in a highly populated area. But they really do not have great attendance and barely travel.
In an either or scenario having to drop two for me it would be Hawaii and New Mexico.
If you were looking to expand I think you try and get into Texas market with UTSA and possibly Rice. Not sure Utep helps much. (Neither does Rice really) Other option you kick the tires with SMU and see if they want to back out of what was already a pretty crappy deal to get into the ACC..
No way do most of us want to stay in the MWC as long as Boise State gets $1.8million more each year then all the other teams. As for the attack, there are always those who will do that, including me from time to time, so never take it personally.
SJSU - any more it is butts on couches. And Bay Area recruits that then get to go home on occasion. You see where Northwestern is going to raze their already small (by B1G standards) 47K seat stadium and replace it with a 35K stadium? Look at what SDSU did. And while a new Pac 12/14 wouldn't be some shining star, interest would increase some. IMHO.
Not a big fan of Texas schools but I guess if two came along it would be OK. Texas is way closer than us to a lot of you.
That would go away on Day 1 in a reverse merger. Another reason for the reverse. All old bets would be off.
I'm pretty hard to insult. Although quite a few years ago I had one a-hole who just made it his mission to insult me every single post, and land on little personal snippets (like being divorced which I mentioned once in passing) and just grind and grind and grind on them. He was despised. After I threatened to track him down and kill him we both got banned. I lurked on our board for several years after that.
Fair just not sure it moves the needle much already having Fresno.
I like idea of Texas schools in conference.
It's going to be real interesting how it shakes out.
If ACC dissolves all bets are off. It could get even crazier.
I am sorry for doing that to you, I had to change my name and move to Las Vegas after I finished insulting you back then!
No worries mate.
I just wish the Pac-2 would firm some things up. The scheduling agreement was a step in the right direction for sure. Funny I promoted and predicted this ad nauseum on my board, and was ridiculed by my fellow Cougs for months. Never did hear a "hey you were right". But then we do this 2-year arrangement with the PCC for the minor sports. And that helps us how? Why didn't we just go all in with the MW on this? Let's all take a test drive of this new car but don't leave the dealer lot. And I believe Baseball, historically a strong sport for the Cougs, is apparently left as an independent?
I have less than zero faith in the Pac-2 leadership. WSU's President and AD should be fired. Dunno about OSU. Our traitor Pac12/2 commissioner still has a job? And the 2 have apparently won full control of the conference? File that F@#% for cause and get the lawsuit going. Can't wait for August 2.
I think the dipshits in charge still hold out some hope of some ACC restructure, or a Big12 invite, or whatever. Well it ain't happening and would suck if it did. Within a couple of years from now some of the traitorous 10 will regret their mutiny. My humble prediction. F-em.
And I want Gloria.
Did you see the margins on that article?On Profitability, you statement is not accurate, at least not last year (link below). Funny things, those facts.
Regarding the Pac-2, we have no other viable options. We got left out in the cold, and I see nothing in the tea leaves that says this will change. I don't buy the Bicoastal thing. At all. If the MW is so desirable to the ACC leftovers, then why is it so undesirable to the Pac-2? (granted including a couple of bottom feeders)
2022-23 Mountain West Revenue & Expenses
Air Force's revenue ranked 57th nationally, and all but one MWC school turned a fiscal profit.
Sjsu making a whopping 200 bucks? Throw a party! (not too big though, maybe cater it with taco bell)
If you are referring to the proposed bicostal league your logic does not make sense. The acc would only partner with a new, smaller PAC that has only the best teams and markets out of the MW, not the entire league.
I haven't seen anything about the ACC trying to land UNM and Hawaii.
You are missing the point that the PAC COULD do something that could save them millions in the long run. Doesn't mean that they will, but it is possible.
I agree the bicostal thing seemed far fetched, but the Syracuse fan did mention UNLV as a part of a ACC west division. I'm doubting the PAC 2 would be left out of that. So maybe it isn't that far fetched?
I could see this working. Schools won’t have student athletes falling out from travel sickness by jumping across timezones every other day.
Would you keep 4 out of conference games, or would you make it 3 to have a rotating home/ away game each season with the opposite coast?
Could see it playing out to be:
1 fcs game,
1 p4 game,
vs reno,
1 in conference opposite coast,
8 regular season games,
championship, and/or bowl.
Selfishly I’d like to have a game at Duke and watch all of those fans go home sad when Unlv wins.
Well I guess that anything is possible. Wonder how the TV money would work out. And again, would this be all about keeping that P5/4 slot in the FB Playoffs?
We'll see. I'm kinda done speculating.
Have you heard anything on your end about what WSU/OSU's goals are? Both in their overall plan and timing? Is the P12 money issue / court case resolved now? I thought I saw that it was but I haven't been following it super closely.
Is WSU/OSU's primary goal to rebuild the Pac conference? I'm assuming so, but that might just be a secondary goal, IF, they're not able to join one of the other power conferences. With all of the shuffling, it's not out of the realm of possibilities that they could still get an invite to the Big 12 (or other). Would they want to do that to stay in the "power 5" or 4 or whatever it ends up? There's a lot more conference money in the power conferences, but there's also a lot more expense with all of the traveling.
OK, I'm interested again (aka beer in hand, bored). First let me link the ACC's 2024 schedule and comment on Bull's design for the PACWest/ACC conference.
So Bull's scenario assumes that 6 current or pending ACC teams go elsewhere: FSU, Clemson, Louisville, Pitt, Miami and Stanford. OK, so the cream, although a few name teams remain (Duke, VT at least).
Atlantic
UNC, NC STATE, DUKE, VIRGINIA, VIRGINIA TECH, WAKE FOREST, GEORGIA TECH, BOSTON COLLEGE, SYRACUSE (Cal and SMU to the West Division, total of 11)
Beyond the top 6, all of the above probably are at least as desirable to the P3 as WSU or OSU, probably more factoring in logistics. So the P3 would eat up the top 6 for starters.
Now to sort of get to rebel2000's question(s), I don't think the Pac-2 has clue #1 WTF they are doing. I have not heard anything lately about the alleged money, which appears to be a mystical number even now. Which as an accountant really pisses me off. I am not aware of any major remaining court issues, I could be wrong. Maybe over the pre-August 2 revenues and expenses. That day is approaching fast.
I think WSU and OSU are futzing around holding out some fleeting hope that they will be invited elsewhere. Big-12 being the only realistic possibility. Well, the door was slammed in our faces, and Big-12 already has 4 new teams to shoehorn in next year. And the above-mentioned ACC 6 to court.
So, and I think foolishly so, a PAC rebuild is plan B. Foolishly in that it would be Plan B not my preference Plan A. I have seen crazier shit than Bull's PAC/MW/ACC plan, But I just don't know. Looks like 2 small conferences tied together by championship games only?
Getting back to the 2024 ACC. 17 teams, no Divisions, 8 conference games? So you play only half of your conference mates? I guess there will be championship games, but HTF do you figure that out when you only play half your league? Nonsense. Stanford plays at Syracuse, Clemson, and NC State. Plus non-con ND. Cal? At Auburn, FSU, Pitt, Wake Forest and SMU. That will be fun! And in the notes - no existing ACC teams will travel to California in back to back seasons. Gee Stanford and especially Cal, that sounds fair compared to your schedule!
Can't wait to see Stanford and Cal's M and W basketball, baseball, W soccer and VB schedules. Stanford fields about 100 total teams (sarcasm alert, but not far off) so I'm sure beach VB and men's water polo will be independent much like now.
Crazy shit. So I stick with my position. Reverse merger with MW under the PAC banner. You guys decide who to bring along or forsake, but we need 12 teams minimum. If SMU, buyer's remorse Cal or someone else fits the bill fine. Max of 14 to keep it out West. Where we all belong. If that isn't enough to keep us Power 5/4 or whatever, then so be it. As I've stated, you all seem to be doing just fine now. WSU and OSU, hopefully with transition help from this mystical Pac-12 residual money, will adjust to the new normal.
Hell I might even brave another road trip in my truck camper.
Guess I'll meander over to my board and share the ACC schedule. Wish some of you besides Meister would stop by and flatulate a little. Go up to the top of your site, Colleges, Pac-12, Washington State. Posting is non-subscription on the FB and BB boards.
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There are 68 total power teams as of today. IF it goes to 3 power conferences of 20 teams each that would leave 8 teams to find new homes. The fight for those 8 would be very strong.
I think Cal will definitely regret it and may come crawling back.
SMU (Not a former PAC team obviously) might be reconsidering going to the ACC. That was a beggars deal they signed to get in.
Stanford? Who knows. May go independent? If they are sticking to their no NIL stance they'll get left in the dust.
Are they gonna trust you to bring down the Wazzu flag to Vegas? Seems like your last MWC trip was a little dodgy and might not make it lol.OK, I'm interested again (aka beer in hand, bored). First let me link the ACC's 2024 schedule and comment on Bull's design for the PACWest/ACC conference.
So Bull's scenario assumes that 6 current or pending ACC teams go elsewhere: FSU, Clemson, Louisville, Pitt, Miami and Stanford. OK, so the cream, although a few name teams remain (Duke, VT at least).
Atlantic
UNC, NC STATE, DUKE, VIRGINIA, VIRGINIA TECH, WAKE FOREST, GEORGIA TECH, BOSTON COLLEGE, SYRACUSE (Cal and SMU to the West Division, total of 11)
Beyond the top 6, all of the above probably are at least as desirable to the P3 as WSU or OSU, probably more factoring in logistics. So the P3 would eat up the top 6 for starters.
Now to sort of get to rebel2000's question(s), I don't think the Pac-2 has clue #1 WTF they are doing. I have not heard anything lately about the alleged money, which appears to be a mystical number even now. Which as an accountant really pisses me off. I am not aware of any major remaining court issues, I could be wrong. Maybe over the pre-August 2 revenues and expenses. That day is approaching fast.
I think WSU and OSU are futzing around holding out some fleeting hope that they will be invited elsewhere. Big-12 being the only realistic possibility. Well, the door was slammed in our faces, and Big-12 already has 4 new teams to shoehorn in next year. And the above-mentioned ACC 6 to court.
So, and I think foolishly so, a PAC rebuild is plan B. Foolishly in that it would be Plan B not my preference Plan A. I have seen crazier shit than Bull's PAC/MW/ACC plan, But I just don't know. Looks like 2 small conferences tied together by championship games only?
Getting back to the 2024 ACC. 17 teams, no Divisions, 8 conference games? So you play only half of your conference mates? I guess there will be championship games, but HTF do you figure that out when you only play half your league? Nonsense. Stanford plays at Syracuse, Clemson, and NC State. Plus non-con ND. Cal? At Auburn, FSU, Pitt, Wake Forest and SMU. That will be fun! And in the notes - no existing ACC teams will travel to California in back to back seasons. Gee Stanford and especially Cal, that sounds fair compared to your schedule!
Can't wait to see Stanford and Cal's M and W basketball, baseball, W soccer and VB schedules. Stanford fields about 100 total teams (sarcasm alert, but not far off) so I'm sure beach VB and men's water polo will be independent much like now.
Crazy shit. So I stick with my position. Reverse merger with MW under the PAC banner. You guys decide who to bring along or forsake, but we need 12 teams minimum. If SMU, buyer's remorse Cal or someone else fits the bill fine. Max of 14 to keep it out West. Where we all belong. If that isn't enough to keep us Power 5/4 or whatever, then so be it. As I've stated, you all seem to be doing just fine now. WSU and OSU, hopefully with transition help from this mystical Pac-12 residual money, will adjust to the new normal.
Hell I might even brave another road trip in my truck camper.
Guess I'll meander over to my board and share the ACC schedule. Wish some of you besides Meister would stop by and flatulate a little. Go up to the top of your site, Colleges, Pac-12, Washington State. Posting is non-subscription on the FB and BB boards.
Heh heh. If I come to Vegas it will be by plane.
A bit off topic, but have you all heard about our former QB? And a former WSU coach, fired for not getting vaxxed, was key in recruiting de Laura to Texas State, only to leave for, I think, San Jose State. Good job TSU!
Texas State QB Jayden de Laura withdraws from school, no longer with team one week after announcing transfer
The quarterback received backlash due to a lawsuit stemming from a 2018 sexual assault case
www.cbssports.com
Yes, he went to SJSU after Purdy left for Reno. Those are two good QB's add in the MWCHeh heh. If I come to Vegas it will be by plane.
A bit off topic, but have you all heard about our former QB? And a former WSU coach, fired for not getting vaxxed, was key in recruiting de Laura to Texas State, only to leave for, I think, San Jose State. Good job TSU!
Texas State QB Jayden de Laura withdraws from school, no longer with team one week after announcing transfer
The quarterback received backlash due to a lawsuit stemming from a 2018 sexual assault case
