The Cougs are doing great. Don't be shocked to see UNLV interviewing your coach after the season. Just saying.
Pac-2 finally firing Commissioner Kliavkoff
- Thread starter Loyal Coug1
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The Cougs are doing great. Don't be shocked to see UNLV interviewing your coach after the season. Just saying.
I'm open to anything.
But Hawaii is a drain and can be football only. UNM solid basketball but football is bad and doesn't look to have any positive trajectory. (Same could have been said about us a year or two back. I do like theor hire of Bronco Mendenhall but that's an extremely tough job. SJSU huge TV market and even when they are good don't draw well..
If you can upgrade from them I think you should.
Looking to build best football conference possible and get eyes on TVs. As for Reno we could still play them every year as an OOC opponent. Would be on par with playing teams like UTEP or New Mexico State types. Or as an upgrade over teams like Bryant or Utah Tech. I don't think that would be a bad scenario. Kinda like CU and CSU.
If I'm the commisioner of a new league I'm trying to make the best conference possible. And who gets the most eyes on TVs.
I'd keep somebody like USU over Reno. Aggies are the littlest of brothers in Utah after Utah and Byu, but it's a state MWC recruits a lot. I wouldn't want to lose that market completely. Again USU is borderline as well.
If it becomes a straight merger nobody left behind, mute point.
If there is going to be trimming fat...Reno would be one I'd consider..
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This agreement (I got a link to it) is heavy reading. The Pac-2 gave a lot of concessions, although we were boxed in to a corner. And Gloria put the hammer down on us. I actually sort of like the "9 members can kick the others out" part - although I suppose that was already in place in the MW? Kind of like the Pac-2 can't poach from you, but you can do it for us.
So Hawaii is obvious, then up to 2 of Reno, NM, USU and SJSU, not necessarily in that order? I dunno, and don't feel like doing exhaustive research on all those schools. San Jose gets kicked around by my Cougs, but a Bay presence is important IMHO. USU and NM? As someone else said, Utah is an important state. NM not so much I guess, but I for one like the footprint of having those states. Every state out West except Arizona (dead to the Pac now) and Montana (no big schools). All the far-flung notions that my pals are throwing out just don't wash with me. I don't the Pac to have schools from Florida, Tennessee, etc. F-that.
SJSU definitely looks good at a glance. Huge market. They simply don't draw well. They don't travel particularly well either (neither do we).
I can see keeping UNM for reason you mentioned. But it's a really sparsely populated state. Not going to help any TV deals. In the event you wanted to keep them, I guess I would go and add NMSU as well and 'dominate' that state. It's not as heavily recruited state like Utah which is why I lean USU over UNM in an either or scenario.
Wyoming is a really tough call as well.
I guess it really comes down to how big do you want the conference to be initially. Start at 12 with eyes at expanding to 14 or 16? Or just jump in both feet and go to 16 immediately.
A lot might depend on Stanford/Cal and their decision with ACC. I don't think they would have to pay an exit fee if ACC crumbles.
I know you aren't big on expanding into Texas but personally if SMU were to become available, I would absolutely court them and UTSA to get into Texas market.
Purely from a football perspective and building a 16 team conference.
WSU
OSU
CAL
STANFORD
FRESNO
SDSU
BOISE STATE
CSU
UNLV
USU
SMU
UTSA
WYOMING
AF
SJSU (I'm contradicting myself here but it is hard to pass up that potential TV market. Plus MW and Pac both recruit Cal heavily obviously.
UNR or UNM
Poor travel for UNLV fans has more to do with decades of losing than anything else. When UNLV went to the bowl game against North Texas about a decade ago, I know there were less than 500 fans that went, but the bowl we just went to had a much better UNLV crowd. No doubt Kansas had far more fans, but from what I could see, I expect UNLV had around 6K-8K fans at the game which was far more than I expected would attend.
We played on a baseball field in our bowl game in Phoenix.. Looked so high school.
The Guaranteed Rate Bowl normally includes the Big12 and Big Ten, and those conferences are not what I would call high school level programs. While I agree that it isn't the greatest place to play, this bowl game and playing Kansas is far better than I had hoped UNLV would get into for a bowl game.
I think it comes down to how do you want to share the $$. There has to be a clear dividing line for a couple of schools that don't bring in the revenue (and aren't projected to improve) nearly at the proportions of the others. There should be the two out. MY guess, Wyoming and Hawaii. But if you already have Stanford and Cal you don't need SJSU.
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Again this is all about money, as every single part of conference realignment has been up to this point.
The Mw might be "doing fine" but there is a lot of financial dead weight. Really only the TV people really know this, perhaps the conference commissioners, but there are teams in the current MW that drop the per team compensation for sure. Which ones are the worst? We could guess. SJSU I would bet is one of them. Great market with practically zero penetration. UNM is the biggest market in a small state. Utah State is a far 3rd place in a small state.
I would guess the current MW plus markets are SDSU, CSU, Boise, Fresno State, and UNLV, and that may be it. Wyoming ( tiny market but near 100% penetration) do well for football, AFA somewhat small but has a bit of a national following, and UNR. The bottom 3 are Hawaii- good penetration of a tiny Market, UNM, and SJSU could easily be the lowest.
I think you don't build bigger than 12. Minimum requirement for a conference championship game for football. Leave room to expand. Even with 12 you are going to be forced to take teams that will hurt the bottom line, don't need more than necessary.
Again if it is about the bottom line, you have to kick the tires on a Texas School. Even if it is just for recruiting purposes. Tulane is a very good market but does stretch the footprint a bit much.
The remaining PAC schools are going to lose money from their previous contract. That is guaranteed. Do you want a 75% pay cut? A 50% pay cut? Would would you be willing to take if your company got bought out and couldn't pay you your salary?
I wonder what happens if several current MW schools decide they want to break away to form a new PAC. I could see a new TV negotiation go very similar to the previous PAC negotiations just due to the fact that the TV execs know that a break away is imminent. That could buy just enough time where the exit fees go down or get eliminated. Not sure what it would take to vote to blow up the current MW.
A new PAC could definitely get messy. But again you have to follow the money, it is the biggest driver for all of these decisions.
Agree on SJSU and the Stanford/Cal thing. . Wyoming is a tough call. Hawaii for sure out in my opinion. If we are talking purely football..WYO over UNM.
Fair points.
How's this for 12 completely hand picked and assuming available.
OSU
WSU
CAL
STANFORD
SMU
UTSA
FRESNO
SDSU
UNLV
CSU
BOISE STATE
AF
Being totally honest not sure I would want to play that conference schedule every year.
Seriously pick any of those 8 teams for UNLV to play where you'd be super confident they could go say 6-2..That's a pretty solid football conference. Easily best G5 out there.
Quick glance SDSU/CSU weakest of the bunch? I don't expect SDSU to be nearly as bad going forward. They aren't far removed from being top of conference.
That would definitely be likely the best to maximize revenues. I don't think that conference will pull the NoCal schools back without an ACC blow up. Time will tell, but we will see if they can get out of that 500 mil fee hurdle. I would guess that would not be sorted out in time to create a new PAC, but who knows.
With a 12 team conference, I think you try to get Gonzaga and Saint Mary's for basketball. 12 is small for basketball, and they would definitely help the bottom line and Improve the conference.
I recently read that the Pac 2 has an agreement with the MWC to merge with the entire conference. Those negotiations are pending but unless the ACC folds, OSU and WSU have no other option at present. Playing the basketball and olympic sports with the WCC will open their eyes to the bandbox 1950's era facilities of the WCC minus the Zags who play before 7000 or so. They have to keep their Power 5 conference going. MWC has to fold en masse to make it happen or at least 8 teams leave to disband the conference. We will see.
If 8 teams left, they will all get hit with the maximum penalty for leaving. It takes 9 votes to get out of the exit fee. There is no chance any of those 9 would agree unless there is an iron clad agreement that they get into the new PAC.
I think you are right.
I mean everyone would want to join a new Pac whatever. But would a new Pac want everyone.
Not sure which post to reply to. One thing about Stanford and Cal - their Football TV ratings have sucked. I don't view them as some sort of great "re-catch". As far as the deadweight teams, WSU and to some extent OSU have kind of been that in the Pac-12 - why do you think we were left behind? - so I sympathize with your lesser programs. We do have fairly good TV ratings though for being in the middle of nowhere.
Well you can sympathize with UNM and a few others. But never Reno. If you are perceived to be showing sympathy for Reno you will be banned.
LOL!
My then wife and I actually went to a WSU-Reno game in Reno many years ago. She had family in the area....
LOL!
Do they participate in any of the Reno State fair competitions?
Like Fastest to Melt a Unirnal Cake?
You went to Reno voluntarily AND your wife has family there? This is definitely a bannable offense!LOL!
The Commission will render our decision thusly.
Well not in Reno. Up the hill from Tahoe. Where I come from that is "in the area".
Fine then. I just talked to my pals at the Pac-12 offices. We are moving the upcoming Pac-12 BB tournament out of Vegas and to Winnemucca.
I have been through Winnemucca. Back in 7th grade, on our way to San Diego. All I really remember is going down what must have been Hwy 95 before it hits I-80. 2 lane highway, road was bare, but there was like 10 feet of snow on both sides. One of those random memories.
