It's just the poaching fee. What that paragraph also speaks of is a departure fee. That fee is not relevant. It would only apply if you, meaning the Pac-2, left during the Scheduling Agreement.
IF REMAINING MWC TEAMS WERE SMART
- Thread starter Bullmastiff 1
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Yeah, I think I misinterpreted the last portion of into meaning “departing PAC 12 members” as if the MW teams leaving were actually PAC members since they had accepted. My bad.
Ok. Confusing as hell. So the "Departure fee" is moot since the Pac/MW did not renew the scheduling agreement?
Termination fee, Departure fee, Withdrawal fee? Geezus. Gobbletygook, eh?
Hey Coug, did you have to create a new rivals account to post on the Rebel page? I went over to the WS forum and was going to jump in on a conversation but it says I have insufficient privileges to reply.
No, I used my same Rivals account. Did you go to the "Cougar Lair" board? Should be able to post no problem. I'm a premium member now, but was able to post there (and over here) before that as just a registered member. Maybe Meister can assist us.
If I’m reading correctly the “withdrawal fee” is the termination fee… I’m pretty sure.
The MW by laws state that the departure fee to be paid by MW teams leaving is to be paid prior to the “effective date”, which would be June of 2026, BUT all distributions to departing institutions will be withheld to be applied to that payment.
So I’m not sure when those distributions occur, but those four have seen their last payments from the MW.
How much money can UNLV collect between now and June 30, 2025 when they’d have to give notice?
Just navigate on this screen to the top right where it says colleges. Go down the drop down list to Pac-12. Then select Washington State from that next drop down list. WazzuWatch will now open on a new screen. Select Cougar Lair from the forum list. You should now be logged on with the same user name that you have on Rebel-Net.
yeah, I went in the Cougar Lair, and opened the "Lots of stuff- Ole miss, Tulane/Memphis, UNLV/AF" thread but it doesn't give me an option to reply.
Maybe they banned me from the last time I was snooping around, who knows?
Yeah, I did that, and it shows me logged in with the same user name, but won't allow me to do anything.
Your shit is ****ed up. I navigated over to that thread and clicked on reply and it works fine.
If I'm getting 10 million a year and you are getting 1.5 million a year on media revenue I'm at an immediate advantage.
Secondly the success of the program is driven in part by money.
Conference affiliation creates ceilings for programs.
A team from the Sun Belt is never going to win a national title. They are also very unlikely to get into the new CFP even if they run the table. Their conference affiliation (weaker conference schedule) will get them passed over by another G5 who may have one loss.
So looking ahead.
PAC has their current 6 plus add UTSA, MEMPHIS,TULANE, USF.
MWC somehow cobbles together NMSU Texas State, North Texas and let's say Sam Houston State.
Boise goes 12-0 wins PAC
UNLV Also goes 12-0 wins MWC
Who gets the group of 5 bid?
Likely Boise based on tougher schedule.
More realistic scenario.
Both go 11-1. Boise still gets in. Now they start filling the 12 team playoffs.
Boise in. SEC champ in. ACC champ in. SEC champ in. BIG 10 Champ in. Big 12 Champ in. No way the powers that be aren't putting in the next best teams from the Big10 and SEC in. Those 12 spots are going to fill up quick and no way a second G5 program is going to get the nod.
The one saving grace to that is the G5 play in tournament/game that has been suggested for that last playoff spot. That sounds good if you aren't in the best G5. Sounds bad if you are in the best G5 conference.
I think this year the MW is the best mostly die to the top of the conference.
You think Alabama or anyone in the SEC wants to see that happen?
I hope it does but skeptical we see more than 1 G5 program get in barring something crazy like 2 undefeated G5 teams that win their conference. Even then I 'Oh we think 2 loss Ole Miss deserves that spot their schedule is just so much tougher than NMSU or Liberty'.
Just curious how you think they will offset the travel cost for Memphis, USC, and Tulane for their other sports? By the time you figure in the millions in additional travel cost for all the other athletic programs at Tulane and Memphis, it could end up as closer to a wash unless they get a large increase in TV contract money from a conference that doesn't currently have a single ranked team and no TV contract.
Tulane had an attendance average of 25,021 in 2023 and are located in a relatively small market in New Orleans when you look at the fact they must compete with LSU for attendance and viewership which is located just up the street in Baton Rouge, as well as many other smaller universities located within the state that also compete for the same market. I lived in Louisiana, and LSU is King while every other school is an afterthought. They would bring very little to a new TV contract.
Memphis is a possible decent market with a game attendance is 2023 of around 29K. They also have the same issue as Tulane in the fact that the University of Tennessee controls most of the state, and Memphis is an afterthought that has been trying to increase their market for decades without a lot of luck with a few exceptions. Memphis averaged 38,668 in attendance back in 2003 and then went up in down bottoming out at 20,078 in 2010 and peaked at 43,802 in 2014. Since then they have been on a steady decline and averaged just over 29K in 2023. While they do bring some value to a new TV contract, they would need millions of additional funds just to offset the travel cost for all the other athletic teams.
The PAC TV deal for 2026 is not even in place, nobody has any idea what that equates to 2 years down the road. Where is the $10MM coming from?
All the P12 is, is a brand name. I mean I get what you're saying, but it's not as strong nationally as you think. We all know most of the rest of the USA thought the previous P12 was ass already and now it has a bunch of MWC and AAC teams with Wazzu and Oregon State? Meh.
There is also no reasonable assumption UNLV's going to stick it out in the MWC.
I don't think the SEC cares.
It wouldn't change anything for them. It would another game or playoff to get into the 12 playoff, the final spot. Similar to the first four we currently have. At least that is how I interpretted it.
I haven't seen a play in for an additional spot, say the best remaining non conference champion?
From a media perspective, I think these mega conferences are going to run dry. The calculus changes with streaming vs linear media.
It’s incredibly expensive to maintain a streaming service. My company hasn’t figured out a way to make it profitable, or even self sustaining yet. Money for these $30m+ per school media deals is going to concentrate to the biggest and most profitable 3 conferences, while everyone else will fight for whats left.
While I do believe a Pac is absolutely an upgrade vs what we have now; it might not be the upgrade we all want it to be. I have a hard time believing that the new media deal for the pac will reach the $12m per year per school that they want in its current format. Why would schools leave the ACC for less than half the money?
It’s incredibly expensive to maintain a streaming service. My company hasn’t figured out a way to make it profitable, or even self sustaining yet. Money for these $30m+ per school media deals is going to concentrate to the biggest and most profitable 3 conferences, while everyone else will fight for whats left.
While I do believe a Pac is absolutely an upgrade vs what we have now; it might not be the upgrade we all want it to be. I have a hard time believing that the new media deal for the pac will reach the $12m per year per school that they want in its current format. Why would schools leave the ACC for less than half the money?
There is some logical reasoning, at least for me. Could the PAC 2 be the biggest swindlers ever? Perhaps, but that seems to be somewhat unlikely.
Teams do not bolt for new conferences without having some idea of what that TV contract will be. It is arguable to SOLE reason realignment even happens these days. It seems to have very little to do with regionality, historical rivals, etc.
The PAC 2 could have easily merged/reverse merged with the MW. Those 2 additions along with everyone else would have likely pushed the total payout per school to 6-7 million I would guess.
Boise jumped ship and they make more than everyone else in the MW, so at the very least the new PAC should be getting more than that easily. Especially when considering the possible fees they may have to at least partially pay.
No secret that the PAC is targeting AAC schools including Memphis. Memphis currently gets 7 mil per year, though the long term stability of that is threatened. But then you factor in travel costs.
It would be extremely foolish to approach Memphis with any confidence without offering at the very least 9 mil per year. Probably at least 10.
There were reports before this happened that a rebuilt PAC, which included UNLV and Air Force could get 15 mil per year. But who knows how accurate that was.
But I think 10+ is a pretty safe bet. Why would the PAC 2 willingly give up at the very least 43 million dollars to create their own conference by raiding the MW if their contract wasn't at least significantly better that what they would have gotten by merging? It has to be a substantial bump for this to make any type of financial sense. They could have simply joined the MW in some fashion, and kept all of their PAC money they netted from being raided themselves.
There are early projections based on markets already in play. Ross Dellenger wrote article today saying those projections are upwards of 10 million dollars.
MWC is at 3 million per now. That number is going down next negotiations based on who we lost.
AAC number was at 7 or 9 million per team, based on a contract that was written with UH, CINCY, MEMPHIS, UCF, SMU in the conference. That contract is not going to be renewed at anywhere near that number.
For chuckles let's assume PAC adds just Tulane and Memphis.
Put that conference up against the MWC and tell me who's getting the bigger media rights deal, remembering the MWC current contract was created with four of the teams no longer here and now in the PAC.
There's no way if things play out like that the MWC conference is getting a similiar media deal. They just aren't.
So yes conference matters because money matters.
And if AFA to AAC rumors are true MWC no longer qualifies as a conference. They are under 8.
I do not think UNLV can continue to build on what Odom started if we get relegated to somewhere like CUSA or a depleted AAC.
You say merge easily but every interview with the new commissioner points to her not wanting to do that. If it was easy it would've been done. She wanted to have both all the money or a large portion of it and get a larger tv deal cut to join and when the MWC turned around and said you need us, she flipped to trying to break them apart. There is assumptions a tv deal was ar least discussed but we also know Boise and SDSU think very highly of themselves and could easily be sold to join a new conference whose outlook has potential to be better than MWC for them if they defect. Then she offered to pay their fees so it became a no brainer... the problem now is you have 2-4 other programs asking for same deal and money gets tight, plus whatever assurances and promises were made to the 4 defectors... it's not easy
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