Why?

[WarthogRebel]

I've watched Rebel football and been a huge homer for 30+ years.

During that time some teams have been able to rise up and become quality non power 5 programs while we hugely under perform. Utah was even able to break free and get in the PAC 12.

These teams can have down years but they can change a coach and come back quickly. I'm thinking Fresno, Reno, SDSU and Boise in our Conference. Outside our conference UCF, Memphis and probably a dozen others.

Why is it they can do this and we can't? This is a serious question, not hypothetical.

I know posters will be quick to say the administration sucks - the boosters are selfish in their personal desires - that's the way UNLV rolls etc. But those aren't specific answers.

There has to be concrete reasons why we are one of the worst programs in the FBS. When you're the worst - or one of the bottom 5 - there should be specific reasons that can be addressed. And when you're that bad it should be easy to find answers.

We should be able to look at UCF and just do what they did. They didn't become an FBS team until 13 years ago. And now they are an excellent program. 10 post season appearances in 13 years. We should be able to figure out what they did and do it ourselves.

And I don't need UCF results. If we went bowling 3 out of 5 years I'd be ecstatic - and I think most fans would be very happy.

I just don't get why it can't be done. Why?

 

[j. spilotro]

I've watched Rebel football and been a huge homer for 30+ years.

During that time some teams have been able to rise up and become quality non power 5 programs while we hugely under perform. Utah was even able to break free and get in the PAC 12.

These teams can have down years but they can change a coach and come back quickly. I'm thinking Fresno, Reno, SDSU and Boise in our Conference. Outside our conference UCF, Memphis and probably a dozen others.

Why is it they can do this and we can't? This is a serious question, not hypothetical.

I know posters will be quick to say the administration sucks - the boosters are selfish in their personal desires - that's the way UNLV rolls etc. But those aren't specific answers.

There has to be concrete reasons why we are one of the worst programs in the FBS. When you're the worst - or one of the bottom 5 - there should be specific reasons that can be addressed. And when you're that bad it should be easy to find answers.

We should be able to look at UCF and just do what they did. They didn't become an FBS team until 13 years ago. And now they are an excellent program. 10 post season appearances in 13 years. We should be able to figure out what they did and do it ourselves.

And I don't need UCF results. If we went bowling 3 out of 5 years I'd be ecstatic - and I think most fans would be very happy.

I just don't get why it can't be done. Why?

I don’t believe it’s as simple as the reason we’ve failed is because every coach “sucks”.

But I honestly believe that from top to bottom (from administration to the fans), it’s been incredibly weak support. No vision. No framework. It’s not being willed. I think there absolutely needs to be a “same page” commitment from top to bottom in order to even budge a hill let alone move a mountain.

The fans aren’t built into that equation. They can get on the same page if they are enticed. So the vision has to come from the top, it has to be well planned and focused. And it takes money to execute.

We can say this has occurred because basketball is/was the focus. And that’s true in large part. But it’s not like there’s been tremendous support for hoops either. Hell, when we were at our best, the administration was awful and the fans made up the difference. But that was an anomaly too. Tark was able to overcome, there aren’t very many who could.

And that’s where I think big names are important for a school like UNLV. I think it’s why Robinson had some success. He was loaded with experience and knew what it takes and his reputation was able to command some positive culture change and commitment.

It’s not easy, in fact, as we are seeing it’s very difficult. Take the past 25 years of UNLV hoops and UNLV football. 50 years of major sports. How many post season wins? 5? 6? 7? How many conference championships? 1? 2?

When the variables like coaches change but the results are similar.... it has to lead you to believe that it’s more of a systematic thing. And I think that’s what it is. As a whole, the major sports don’t get the top to bottom support they need to thrive.

 

[WarthogRebel]

I don’t believe it’s as simple as the reason we’ve failed is because every coach “sucks”.

But I honestly believe that from top to bottom (from administration to the fans), it’s been incredibly weak support. No vision. No framework. It’s not being willed. I think there absolutely needs to be a “same page” commitment from top to bottom in order to even budge a hill let alone move a mountain.

The fans aren’t built into that equation. They can get on the same page if they are enticed. So the vision has to come from the top, it has to be well planned and focused. And it takes money to execute.

We can say this has occurred because basketball is/was the focus. And that’s true in large part. But it’s not like there’s been tremendous support for hoops either. Hell, when we were at our best, the administration was awful and the fans made up the difference. But that was an anomaly too. Tark was able to overcome, there aren’t very many who could.

And that’s where I think big names are important for a school like UNLV. I think it’s why Robinson had some success. He was loaded with experience and knew what it takes and his reputation was able to command some positive culture change and commitment.

It’s not easy, in fact, as we are seeing it’s very difficult. Take the past 25 years of UNLV hoops and UNLV football. 50 years of major sports. How many post season wins? 5? 6? 7? How many conference championships? 1? 2?

When the variables like coaches change but the results are similar.... it has to lead you to believe that it’s more of a systematic thing. And I think that’s what it is. As a whole, the major sports don’t get the top to bottom support they need to thrive.

"I think there absolutely needs to be a “same page” commitment from top to bottom in order to even budge a hill let alone move a mountain."

I hear ya. But in order to get that "commitment" from top to bottom it takes a very strong leader at the top. And we've gone 30 years without that leadership? It just doesn't seem possible. It seems more likely that people are working against football rather than for it.

Memphis has only been in bowl series football for 5 years - and they've been to five bowls. We've been in D1/FBS for 41 years and been to 4 bowls.

It just doesn't seem possible we could have done worse without trying to be bad.

 

[j. spilotro]

"I think there absolutely needs to be a “same page” commitment from top to bottom in order to even budge a hill let alone move a mountain."

I hear ya. But in order to get that "commitment" from top to bottom it takes a very strong leader at the top. And we've gone 30 years without that leadership? It just doesn't seem possible. It seems more likely that people are working against football rather than for it.

Memphis has only been in bowl series football for 5 years - and they've been to five bowls. We've been in D1/FBS for 41 years and been to 4 bowls.

It just doesn't seem possible we could have done worse without trying to be bad.

It does seem impossible but it makes sense to me. It’s really the only thing that seems consistent. Look at the top leadership, prez’ and AD’s... when has it been a strength/strength? I can’t tell you because I don’t believe it’s been there. It’s rare that we’ve had even one as a strength.

They say money can solve everything but UNLV FB could be gifted 100M and that doesn’t guarantee anything at all. You still need a blueprint for success, you need a timeframe and benchmarks, you need focus..... I agree with your initial statement - it takes leadership and commitment. I think we are extremely low with it to be honest.

 

[Rebel1986]

The simple answer is Robert Maxson. In the 70's into the mid 80's UNLV went from being one of the top lower division teams to having an immediate impact as a D1 program and had the best year in the history of the program the year that he took over and totally dismantled the football team.

1978 7-4
1979 9-1-2
1980 7-4
1981 6-6
1982 3-8
1983 7-4
1984 11-2 Robert Maxson took over as President
1985 5-5-1

After that the program went down the toilet and stayed down!

 

[j. spilotro]

The simple answer is Robert Maxson. In the 70's into the mid 80's UNLV went from being one of the top lower division teams to having an immediate impact as a D1 program and had the best year in the history of the program the year that he took over and totally dismantled the football team.

1978 7-4
1979 9-1-2
1980 7-4
1981 6-6
1982 3-8
1983 7-4
1984 11-2 Robert Maxson took over as President
1985 5-5-1

After that the program went down the toilet and stayed down!

I absolutely agree that he was the ignition to everything that has transpired. No question about it. He made it clear on numerous occasions that academics was more important than athletics. And there’s little question in my mind that he was a parasite to athletics - he used the platform ... but he clearly wanted academics to be above athletics. But they weren’t. So hamstring athletics and make it fall instead of elevating academics. That’s the quickest way. And he did it. It’s what he’s known for.

But still, there was time for a recovery. Can’t pin that solely on Maxson. But we’ve had a couple more decades plus of poor leadership, maybe marginal at times.

But yeah, to me, that’s at the very heart of UNLV being very short of what they could/should be.

It absolutely wasn’t worth it. Now we suck at sports and we have elevated ourselves from poor to mediocre academics. We’d have been at mediocre academics by now regardless just through rapid city growth. So in my mind, we sacrificed greatness to be nothing.

My degree, I’m proud of it from UNLV - it was a very specific area of study, one in which there was need and one which was difficult. It’s served me well.

But my pride for my education pales in comparison to what Tarkanian built here. Fans were raped by academia.