local outsider looking in

[caleco's]

hey reb fans

i have been in lv for 16 years. i am a pitt alum but have gone to many unlv football and hoops games. i love college sports. I was disappointed to see sanchez fail. i really liked the hire. what were the top 2 or 3 issues the last 3 years. it seems the d couldnt get it together.

i really thought recruting would tick upwards with the new facility and stadium. as a pitt fan i can tell you sharing a city with a pro team is tough on a fanbase as far as competition goes for butts in seats.

i always thought the potential for the UNLV program was intriguing based on location. its vegas for heavens sake! lol.

saw the post on the big 12. if the program can rise up a bit i see that being a more make sense move vs the pac 12. they (pac 12) dont seem to need more of a market they dominate.. the big 12 would pick up 1.5 million new viewers in a plave where they have little. the pac 12 has viewers out here regardless. the big 12 fans WOULD travel here really well and eat up tickets for those road games. heck almost any non pac 12 p5 conf would. (think of those wisconsin games years ago)

ill hang up and listen...go rebs!

PS love the new hire!

 

[karaoke_jesus]

Sanchez’ biggest failure was his staff hires IMO. Now, whether the budget at UNLV hamstrung him or not I can’t say for sure, but most of them couldn’t coach their way out of a parking lot. Just my opinion.

 

[Bullmastiff 1]

Sanchez’ biggest failure was his staff hires IMO. Now, whether the budget at UNLV hamstrung him or not I can’t say for sure, but most of them couldn’t coach their way out of a parking lot. Just my opinion.

Cotton was solid. When you consider the constant QB juggling, they still managed to avg 30 ppg with him at helm.

Baer was bad.

Skipper....Well it wasn't much better.

That and he whiffed with the 2016 class on the defensive side of the ball. That helped seal his fate.

Defense has been so bad for so long here..

 

[bcvegaspt]

QB coach did the best job of collecting a paycheck and free UNLV gear!

 

[Bullmastiff 1]

hey reb fans

i have been in lv for 16 years. i am a pitt alum but have gone to many unlv football and hoops games. i love college sports. I was disappointed to see sanchez fail. i really liked the hire. what were the top 2 or 3 issues the last 3 years. it seems the d couldnt get it together.

i really thought recruting would tick upwards with the new facility and stadium. as a pitt fan i can tell you sharing a city with a pro team is tough on a fanbase as far as competition goes for butts in seats.

i always thought the potential for the UNLV program was intriguing based on location. its vegas for heavens sake! lol.

saw the post on the big 12. if the program can rise up a bit i see that being a more make sense move vs the pac 12. they (pac 12) dont seem to need more of a market they dominate.. the big 12 would pick up 1.5 million new viewers in a plave where they have little. the pac 12 has viewers out here regardless. the big 12 fans WOULD travel here really well and eat up tickets for those road games. heck almost any non pac 12 p5 conf would. (think of those wisconsin games years ago)

ill hang up and listen...go rebs!

PS love the new hire!

Big12 needs teams. Would probably like to expand their brand west. The other team I think they might be interested in is CSU. Same with the Pac12. Houston makes a lot of sense in terms of geography, not sure if they make academic requirements or have Tier 1 status or not to get in.

One problem for Vegas is that it still carries a bit of a stigma (unfair but still there). Parents might be reluluctant to see their kids come here. Plus the Rebs haven't won enough to get anybody excited enough to come here or retain much of the high end talent here.

Delays in the funding resulted in the facility not getting done until it was essentially to late for Coach Sanchez to take full advantage of it.

Top issues for why it didn't work. Tough to nail it down really. He started off pretty strong. 3,4,5 wins. Improvement was slow, but there. Then year four hit and everything started to go south and a lot carried over into this season.

But if I had to nail it down:

1) He might have been in a little over his head with Xs and Os. A lot of close games turned into 2nd half blowouts.

2) Failure to develope any consistent QB play.

3) He missed a lot on JC recruits. Got very little production out of them except for some OL guys.

4) Failure to fix the defense. He missed big in 2016 recruiting class on defense. Only three guys remain from that class and none have broken the two deep really.

5) Apathy. Outside of some real die hard fans, UNLV football has never really made any in roads with the city. We just haven't won enough to get people excited. As a result there is no semblance of a home field advantage.

I like the Arroyo hire considering where it could have gone and what UNLV can attract and afford. There were some other names that I liked better like Scalley the Utah DC, Avalos the Oregon DC and Jay Hill the Weber State coach. But Arroyo was a solid get for UNLV. I think he may do pretty well here if he is able to parlay the facilities into an uptick in recruiting.

 

[BleedRebelRed90]

Top issues for why it didn't work. Tough to nail it down really. He started off pretty strong. 3,4,5 wins. Improvement was slow, but there. Then year four hit and everything started to go south and a lot carried over into this season.

History forgets the quality of the wins and losses, but I tend not to. Arguably year 4 and 5 were as good as any years of the Sanchez era (and by Massey were the best two years) but oddly both years had two late victories to help the numbers.

With so few wins, win total is heavily influenced by the number of non-conf wins "scheduled". In 2017 and 2018 UNLV scheduled two NC wins (although the Rebels failed to get the Howard win), in 2019 UNLV scheduled only one NC win, and in 2020 UNLV has scheduled 0 NC wins.

2015 3-9 (2-9 vs FBS) Massey #148
GOOD WINS: 7-6 UNR
BAD LOSSES: 2-10 Wyo 3-9 FSU
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 4

2016 4-8 (3-8 vs FBS) Massey #146
GOOD WINS: 8-6 Wyo
BAD LOSSES: 4-8 SJSU 5-7 UNR
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 5

2017 5-7 (5-6 vs FBS) Massey #129
GOOD WINS: 10-4 Fresno
BAD LOSSES: FCS Howard 3-9 UNR 4-9 BYU
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 3

2018 4-8 (3-8 vs FBS) Massey #126
GOOD WINS: 8-5 UNR 7-6 SDSU
BAD LOSSES: 3-9 UNM 1-11 SJSU
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 5

2019 4-8 (3-8 vs FBS) Massey #128
GOOD WINS: 7-5 UNR
BAD LOSSES: 4-8 CSU 4-8 Fresno
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 5

 

[caleco's]

History forgets the quality of the wins and losses, but I tend not to. Arguably year 4 and 5 were as good as any years of the Sanchez era (and by Massey were the best two years) but oddly both years had two late victories to help the numbers.

With so few wins, win total is heavily influenced by the number of non-conf wins "scheduled". In 2017 and 2018 UNLV scheduled two NC wins (although the Rebels failed to get the Howard win), in 2019 UNLV scheduled only one NC win, and in 2020 UNLV has scheduled 0 NC wins.

2015 3-9 (2-9 vs FBS) Massey #148
GOOD WINS: 7-6 UNR
BAD LOSSES: 2-10 Wyo 3-9 FSU
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 4

2016 4-8 (3-8 vs FBS) Massey #146
GOOD WINS: 8-6 Wyo
BAD LOSSES: 4-8 SJSU 5-7 UNR
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 5

2017 5-7 (5-6 vs FBS) Massey #129
GOOD WINS: 10-4 Fresno
BAD LOSSES: FCS Howard 3-9 UNR 4-9 BYU
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 3

2018 4-8 (3-8 vs FBS) Massey #126
GOOD WINS: 8-5 UNR 7-6 SDSU
BAD LOSSES: 3-9 UNM 1-11 SJSU
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 5

2019 4-8 (3-8 vs FBS) Massey #128
GOOD WINS: 7-5 UNR
BAD LOSSES: 4-8 CSU 4-8 Fresno
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 5

scheduling is key. no one cares who you beat they just love the optics of the record. look no further than 2018 syracuse or 2019 indiana. bad teams beating other bad teams. but with the ooc scheudling you can really look better than you are. hell thats the big 10 model.

i had no idea you guys had that bad of a whiff on the 2016 class

 

[WarthogRebel]

Big12 needs teams. Would probably like to expand their brand west. The other team I think they might be interested in is CSU. Same with the Pac12. Houston makes a lot of sense in terms of geography, not sure if they make academic requirements or have Tier 1 status or not to get in.

One problem for Vegas is that it still carries a bit of a stigma (unfair but still there). Parents might be reluluctant to see their kids come here. Plus the Rebs haven't won enough to get anybody excited enough to come here or retain much of the high end talent here.

Delays in the funding resulted in the facility not getting done until it was essentially to late for Coach Sanchez to take full advantage of it.

Top issues for why it didn't work. Tough to nail it down really. He started off pretty strong. 3,4,5 wins. Improvement was slow, but there. Then year four hit and everything started to go south and a lot carried over into this season.

But if I had to nail it down:

1) He might have been in a little over his head with Xs and Os. A lot of close games turned into 2nd half blowouts.

2) Failure to develope any consistent QB play.

3) He missed a lot on JC recruits. Got very little production out of them except for some OL guys.

4) Failure to fix the defense. He missed big in 2016 recruiting class on defense. Only three guys remain from that class and none have broken the two deep really.

5) Apathy. Outside of some real die hard fans, UNLV football has never really made any in roads with the city. We just haven't won enough to get people excited. As a result there is no semblance of a hime field advantage.

I like the Arroyo hire. There were some other names that I liked better like Scalley the Utah DC, Avalos the Oregon DC and Jay Hill the Weber State coach. But Arroyo was a solid get for UNLV. I think he may do pretty well here if he is able to parlay the facilities into an uptick in recruiting.

"4) Failure to fix the defense. He missed big in 2016 recruiting class on defense. Only three guys remain from that class and none have broken the two deep really."

IMO, his failure to field an adequate defense is the basis for Sanchez failure. The poor defense caused at least two losses a year. Fix those and we'd have a bowl team most years. With a bowl team and a better win/loss record I think we get better recruits. Better recruits equals even more success.

I hope the new coach gets a top flight DC and we can get our defense up to at least middle of the road MW conference standards.

 

[Bullmastiff 1]

History forgets the quality of the wins and losses, but I tend not to. Arguably year 4 and 5 were as good as any years of the Sanchez era (and by Massey were the best two years) but oddly both years had two late victories to help the numbers.

With so few wins, win total is heavily influenced by the number of non-conf wins "scheduled". In 2017 and 2018 UNLV scheduled two NC wins (although the Rebels failed to get the Howard win), in 2019 UNLV scheduled only one NC win, and in 2020 UNLV has scheduled 0 NC wins.

2015 3-9 (2-9 vs FBS) Massey #148
GOOD WINS: 7-6 UNR
BAD LOSSES: 2-10 Wyo 3-9 FSU
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 4

2016 4-8 (3-8 vs FBS) Massey #146
GOOD WINS: 8-6 Wyo
BAD LOSSES: 4-8 SJSU 5-7 UNR
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 5

2017 5-7 (5-6 vs FBS) Massey #129
GOOD WINS: 10-4 Fresno
BAD LOSSES: FCS Howard 3-9 UNR 4-9 BYU
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 3

2018 4-8 (3-8 vs FBS) Massey #126
GOOD WINS: 8-5 UNR 7-6 SDSU
BAD LOSSES: 3-9 UNM 1-11 SJSU
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 5

2019 4-8 (3-8 vs FBS) Massey #128
GOOD WINS: 7-5 UNR
BAD LOSSES: 4-8 CSU 4-8 Fresno
BLOWOUT LOSSES: 5

I know you like the analytics. The Massey stuff is interesting.

But when you tie your career high in blowout losses, I'm not sure it's 'better'...

 

[Bullmastiff 1]

scheduling is key. no one cares who you beat they just love the optics of the record. look no further than 2018 syracuse or 2019 indiana. bad teams beating other bad teams. but with the ooc scheudling you can really look better than you are. hell thats the big 10 model.

i had no idea you guys had that bad of a whiff on the 2016 class

We remember good wins..

Sanford year four with back to back wins over a ranked ASU team and win over Iowa State is still remembered with great fondness....It was our glory month...

 

[caleco's]

We remember good wins..

Sanford year four with back to back wins over a ranked ASU team and win over Iowa State is still remembered with great fondness....It was our glory month...

i get it and recall that strectch. i guess my point is schedule as many cupkaaes as possible and win. who cares if you bear 3 scrub teams and lost to one good on ooc. the optics of the wins are what anyobmne cares about and easy schedule at 8-5 vs a hatd one at 5-7. college football is driven by perception not the actual opponents. the record drives the perceptio not who the opponemts actually were

 

[Bullmastiff 1]

i get it and recall that strectch. i guess my point is schedule as many cupkaaes as possible and win. who cares if you bear 3 scrub teams and lost to one good on ooc. the optics of the wins are what anyobmne cares about and easy schedule at 8-5 vs a hatd one at 5-7. college football is driven by perception not the actual opponents. the record drives the perceptio not who the opponemts actually were

I'd be good with it..

 

[dcut03]

We tried that in the 2018 season. Pretty soft OOC.
We need to play a name team, preferably a home and home for financial reasons. We need a "pay me game" on the road and some team that can potentially sell some tickets for the home game. We cannot afford to play all cupcakes in OOC. Also that won't work to get more fans to the games in Vegas.

 

[karaoke_jesus]

I'd be good with it..

The downside is the flamethrower the fan base will continue to take to the program for getting run off the brand new field by Cornell and Jackson State. I’d rather continue to get paid to get roasted by the Ohio State’s and USC’s.

 

[Bullmastiff 1]

The downside is the flamethrower the fan base will continue to take to the program for getting run off the brand new field by Cornell and Jackson State. I’d rather continue to get paid to get roasted by the Ohio State’s and USC’s.

If by fan base you mean all six of us and by flame thrower you mean a can of aqua net and a lighter....

Yes...

 

[karaoke_jesus]

If by fan base you mean all six of us and by flame thrower you mean a can of aqua net and a lighter....

Yes...

The tens of fans will be outraged

 

[rebel5280]

I believe Hauck had a "cupcake" schedule that year he went 7-5 and boy did it get ugly in the Heart of Dallas bowl game.
UNLV has to play a balanced schedule and start beating upper echelon teams in the MWC and surprise a few OOC P-5 teams to be battle tested and raise the overall profile of UNLV football. There are times when UNLV is playing football against teams and we don't even look like a college football team compared to other similar schools (Ark St. and Wyo).

Whether that is talent or schedule who knows but the talent now needs to be elevated by the new guy and I believe schedule is in his per view as well.

I would love for UNLV to become like Utah St or Fresno State back a few years when they took on all comers and looked like they belonged on the same field!

 

[dcut03]

First step is getting bowl eligible, looking good enough to get invited, then beating another mediocre .500 level team in the said bowl game. Unfortunately that still may be a few years away. But that is the bar for Arroyo to keep his job and have fans more or less "happy".

Hopefully that creates momentum to take the next step. Being better than mediocre.

 

[caleco's]

First step is getting bowl eligible, looking good enough to get invited, then beating another mediocre .500 level team in the said bowl game. Unfortunately that still may be a few years away. But that is the bar for Arroyo to keep his job and have fans more or less "happy".

Hopefully that creates momentum to take the next step. Being better than mediocre.

^^^this^^^

Get the wins first anyway you can.

 

[RebelTomola]

the reason Sanchez failed it has been pointed out another issue is no consistency at QB until oblad. Armari is good but not a qb. It doesn't help that Sanchez called Armari the next Randal Cunningham.

there is weapons on the O the issue has been pointed out the D we need a great D

 

[dcut03]

^^^this^^^

Get the wins first anyway you can.

Very true but there are some pitfalls.
First you can only play 1 lower division team and have it count towards bowl eligibility.
Second, we have to play big teams on the road just for the paycheck that comes with it. Until the program can run in the black based off of the gates at home games it needs the income.
Third, the conference has improved. Pretty big jump this year vs last. The conference OOC was much better this past season, with stiff competition for the bowl games. Not nearly as many "gimmies" within the conference any more.
So it will be hard to get bowl eligible by scheduling alone. So unfortunately, we just have to get better... lol.

 

[Rebel1986]

The only reason we made a bowl game under coach Hauck is that they played a very weak schedule with only one win against a team with a winning record (SDSU), one win verse a bad lower division team, one win verse a 6-6 team, and the other 4 wins against teams that won 4 or less games (They had 1 win, 2 wins, 3 wins, and 4 wins).

 

[caleco's]

The only reason we made a bowl game under coach Hauck is that they played a very weak schedule with only one win against a team with a winning record (SDSU), one win verse a bad lower division team, one win verse a 6-6 team, and the other 4 wins against teams that won 4 or less games (They had 1 win, 2 wins, 3 wins, and 4 wins).

exactly and that is what the team needs now. get to a bowl back to back years. noone remembers who the wins were against. schedule for the results